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I think these conversations are missing the mark because the heart of LIMA is not the exhaustion of the other quadrants before utilizing Positive Punishment. It is not “a force free approach until”……How LIMA someone can be is a measure of competency (to asses and tactically approach a dog’s whole situation to cynopraxically create a plan for behavioral modification) according to LIMA’s author. Sometimes positive punishment at high levels has to be used very early in a training plan in order for it be least invasive. In my experience when trainers brag about not using certain tools or not training with food etc. they are limited to a marketing platform that can’t be consistently LIMA because LIMA is not limited to tools or lack thereof. SRL defines it as least invasive minimally aversive. A hard golden retriever is likely to respond differently to physical aversives than a soft malinois. Likewise, a pack driven Rottweiler will respond differently to socially invasive techniques than a genetically independent Husky. There are also outliers. To be LIMA would take different approaches to each quadrant of operant conditioning and the interpersonal relationships for each dog. Plus…there are humans involved! We have to consider their strengths and limitations.
I get that they want to combat the horrible narrative of some organizations, but just like my lil post here, a quick convo or comment can’t begin to cover all of the things that must be considered. Meanwhile, since LIMA is a measure of competency, a trainer should get better at being LIMA as they continue to learn. I’m definitely more LIMA today than I was 2 years ago and 2 years ago I was more LIMA than I was 20 years ago. Sometimes I feel guilty for the dogs in front of me because I plan on continuing to improve and that means they are getting the most LIMA of me now…but not the LIMA I hope to be in another 2 years.
I agree with you @dave-z they got LIMA wrong. But….they did discuss the necessity for competent use of aversives and other topics that I think were well thought out so that was nice to hear. I love what she said at the end about errorless learning.
